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Atari Pole Position pcbs


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  • 9 months later...

Only one cared to take a guess. OK.... Cheers Dave.

 

l think it's because there are two versions of the Atari PP, Ver.1 & Ver.2.

 

Somehow they got mixed up. The numbers are correct on the eproms, but maybe they were reprogrammed. That's my theory.

 

Will be looking into at some stage.. possibly never. :)

 

This game is much easier to play BTW, than the Namco PPII. Maybe because in PPII you can go faster... :)

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  • 4 months later...
Incorrect EPROM or PROM will cause that for sure.

 

Cheers mate. I checked all the eproms and they all appear good. Put them through ROM ident. Most idenfifed as belonging to both Atari sets, ver.1 or ver.2. poleposa1 or poleposa2. Going to have another look at it now. :)

 

Update: just found 11N on the video PCB is a ver.2. All the others report working with ver.1 and ver2. so this could be it. My PP might be version 1 and the version 2 is causing the issue I'm hoping. Clearing 11N to burn right now.

 

Ah dam... that didn't work. Boots n plays with ver.1 on 11N but still signs are bad. :( sigh.

 

I have a 21 version PCBs. CPU is a 21 D and the Video 21 C. Does this mater? I got the boards n bits from all over. Does anyone one know what set I should burn for this version of PCB?

Edited by taito
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Look at this chart... it shows you what the checksums should be... Look at the ones that aren't "merged" in the table in MAMEDB - blank entries in that column. These are the ones that should be different from the Namco version. You have a Namco one where it shouldn't be. It may even be the PROMs you got.

 

PP ROMs.png

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Hi @channelmaniac. Thanks! I'll get to work on that.

 

So if I'm following correctly... Merged means the image is used in both Atari and Namco, but the ones with the blank in the Merge columb means they are unique to Atari... so I should check them out especially. and you're also saying my proms may be different too? (the little ttl shaped IC's?)

 

Since I got the EPROMs shipped to me, pulled from another board, I could have anything in there, so I think when the birds are up I'll take another close look at it. :)

 

Thanks

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To be sure I tried that, and I also tried this. I uploading all the images to ROM ident and checking versions. Here's what I found.

 

They are all Atari version 1 + 2, (polposa1, poleposa2), except for two on the cpu cpu, and one on the video pcb. They came up as just Atari version 2, (poleposa2).

 

So I've concluded the set is Ver 2. owing to the fact that all the others are merged (ver.1 or ver.2 compatible).

 

Still doesn't explain why it renders the wrong images. Thanks @channelmaniac for your suggestion. :)

 

I checked the proms at 4L, 5K, 8M, 11C, 11D, 11E and 12H. And they are Pole position I.

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A letter to the US

 

I just posted this on KLOV.

 

Hi guys. A year or so back I thought it a great idea to build an Atari PP PCB set from parts. So I rebuilt a Pole Position from pieces sourced from the US, Canada and Australia.

 

All the parts came together, and the game runs very nicely, but I've noticed that the signs are mucked up, plus the puddles do not appear, just a black rectangle on the track.

 

I uploaded the images to ROM Ident and they seam to check out. I'm posting my findings here as I think they check out and I'm seeking other peoples opinions.

 

It would be good if I could just reburn every image but I'm having trouble with what I should burn as the manuals have two different numbers depending on what manual you have. Also the the eprom sets don't have the ones listed in the manual in Mame. You have to use an equivalent which I worked out somewhat after uploading to ROM ident.

 

I'll list what I have as identified by ROM ident this format.

 

Location Label (equivalent) [set]

 

Example: EPROM at location 12J had a sticker label 120. In ROM ident It came up in Atari sets poleposa1, poleposa2, which is version 1 and 2. Those few that came up as Atari PPII also I've noted that as [polepos2a]. ROM ident referred to it as (151), the equivalent according to ROM ident.

 

(I created a spreadsheet of the Video PCB for ease of identification, attached below.)

 

VIDEO PCB

 

Cars and Signs...

 

12J 120 (151) [poleposa1, poleposa2, polepos2a]

13J 119 (150) [poleposa1, poleposa2]

12K 122 (153) [poleposa1, poleposa2]

13K 121 (152) [poleposa1, poleposa2]

12L 124 (155) [poleposa1, poleposa2]

13L 123 (154) [poleposa1, poleposa2]

12N 126 (157) [poleposa1, poleposa2]

13N 125 (156) [poleposa1, poleposa2]

*The Cars and Signs circuit refers to rows 12 and 13. Omitting 12M and 13M as they have no sockets.

 

The others..

 

2N 134 (134) [poleposa1, poleposa2]

2M 128 (159) [poleposa1, poleposa2, polepos2a]

2L 127 (158) [poleposa1, poleposa2, polepos2a]

 

 

6N 133 () [poleposa1, poleposa2]

7N 132 () [poleposa1, poleposa2]

 

11N 231 (231) [poleposa2, polepos2a]

 

In a spreadsheet of the video pcb it's easier to see what I have.

 

Screenshot from 2019-02-24 02:53:43.png

 

 

CPU PCB

 

3E (203) [poleposa2]

3L (101) [poleposa1, poleposa2]

4E (204) [poleposa1, poleposa2]

4L (102) [poleposa1, poleposa2]

7F (116) [poleposa1, poleposa2]

7H (105) [poleposa1, poleposa2]

9C (106) [poleposa1, poleposa2, polepos2a]

12E (111) [poleposa1, poleposa2]

12F (110) [poleposa1, poleposa2]

 

 

 

I've done this more than a couple of times, and I'm sure it's not a missing EPROM. That's why I listed the files, so people can have a look and see that the files I have make sense. No namco files were identified by ROM ident, just Atari. If anyone can see a discrepancy please let me know.

 

I actually think I have a hardware issue. Symptoms are doubled picture, overlap, so this would be caused by a faulty RAM, address or decoding system. Suspecting the 74ls139, but don't have a spare to swap in at the moment.

 

 

I checked a video online of an Atari Pole Position and both the signs, Namco and Atari appear in the game.

 

The order goes....

 

Dig Dug

Centipede

Red arrow, yellow background, mine is white with red arrow.

Pole Position

Centipede

Namco Amusement creators

Namco - small sign text only

Dig Dug

Atari- small sign text only

and on and on...

Edited by taito
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Well it was worth a go. Socketed and popped in a new 74ls139 but no difference. :(

 

Burning some new EPROMs, last stitch effort. Who know's, may work??? I'm out of ideas and my comfort zone on this one. It's going to auction..

 

UPDATE: Last stich effort to get fix the mixed up signs. I burn 8 new EPROMs for the locations concerned... but still not fixed. I'm all out of ideas peebs.

 

So I started the project thinking I could fix a few of these. Maybe be someone who could be called upon to fix this game, but a man's got to know his limitations! So I've repaired almost 2 of these game pcbs, one Namco, one Atari, but the Atari one has got me beat.

 

I'm done!

Edited by taito
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Thanks @channelmaniac. That's an interesting read. I couldn't find anything though, could you elaborate for me? Theres's something about changing Japan version to Atari ver, otherwise signs appear messes up...

 

I'm afraid my eyes have rolled back into my head a few days ago working on PP, and have stayed there since. :)

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