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2 Pac Clear Coat Warning!


Arcade King

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As promised like 4 months ago here are the pics of what happened to my STTNG machine after probably 2 or 3 months the clear was done.

I wasnt going to put this thread up until it was fixed but I've decided it will have to be recleared to get it back to something I'd be happy to keep.

 

I had taken the machine to woka's meet on the 26 of April and no issues at all. I hadn't turned it on for a few weeks after that because I had other projects, my daughter maybe played 1 or 2 games the night before I noticed it.

One morning I come down to lift the playfield up to check the flippers coils were all correct when I noticed this

 

IMG_1126.jpg

 

WHAT THE FUCK I said !

 

Naturally I made it worse by pressing around and generally being a dick head.

 

IMG_1133.jpg

 

Theory

 

Myself and Scott believe this was the caused by a combination of heat from the globes which heated up the insert which in turn moved as it cooled and pulled the decal that is glued to the top of the plastic insert away, Factor in the chilly Autumn mornings and you got a cocktail for insert disaster.

I've seen this on quite a few Diamond coated pins but nothing this bad, usually you may get a paper thin milky line around some bits of a insert but because this had 5 coats of clear there was no way the decal was going to move with the plastic insert.

 

Prevention

 

If you want to prevent these problem consider the following as mandatory.

 

1. Reglue all inserts before you clear! Use some super glue around the underside of the insert and don't skimp. Reseat any raised or lowered inserts using a heat gun on the underside. There are topics on the forum that cover this in more detail.

2. too many coats of clear may not be a good idea. If the playfield is already diamond plated then maybe just got with 2 coats. (shoot me down on this)

3. Use LED's under inserts where possible, this will take the heat factor to nil. They even have the large 906 bulbs in LED form which was probably the cause of the bulk of the damage in the shield area on STTNG. Remeber there is one flasher and 2 555's under each of the 3 shield inserts.

 

Repair

 

First off I'd like to thank Savage for taking the time to come over and do this.

These pic's is where Scott is cutting around the decal and removing it from the insert. He then sanded the glue off the top of it. The black line had to be repainted around the edge.

 

IMG_1159.jpg

 

Here Scott has brushed on some 2 pac to fill the hole. Unknown to us the 2 pac clear reacted with the insert plastic and some tiny cracks appeared on the surface of the insert. Scott decided to have another try and wiped the clear out then sanded the top to remove the cracks.

 

IMG_1163.jpg

 

Seemed to be ok at this point. :unsure Problem was it just looked too good so we decided to do the other 2.

 

IMG_1164.jpg

 

Well heres what it looked like with a fluro under it.

 

IMG_1168.jpg

 

Looks good huh? well it did. Was about 6 pm Scott just got in his car then fuck me dead all three inserts started getting surface cracks. Not really much we could do.

Actually didnt look that bad when the clear was hard but could still see the tiny cracks, guess will just have to live with it.

Lesson learned, you must cover the insert with something before clearing. I have no idea what the decal plastic/mylar or what ever was made of but it was very thin, hopefully somebody in the know can tell us.

 

Another problem I've run into is once its sanded down I'm left with some tiny imperfections like pitting specially around the edges (ill have to take a pic).

Scott has come out 3 times if a effort to fix it but I think I'm just going to get him to clear it again and just chalk it up to a learning experience.

 

I'm no expert by a long shot but I think its important to share your experiences with other to help them avoid any misfortune such as i had.

Again be interested to know what the decal is made of.

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thanks for posting this up, alot of great information!

I have never ever seen a STTNG without the hairline cracking on the green inserts, its just worse on some

I tell ya what, damn they looked nice uncracked! It's a shame they crack.. awesome lookin inserts imo :)

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Hmm I think you did the right thing reworking it though, as it would have gotten worse over time for sure.

 

Dunno much about 2pack but can you change the ratios a bit to make it go off slower?

 

I only thinking that if it works a bit like epoxy, then the faster it goes off it can make heat and also be more chemically 'active' - both which may have lead to the surface cracks.

 

Either that or the solvent basically relieved the stress in the injection moulded plastics and caused the cracking.

 

I might add though, that the hairline cracking/crazing is pretty common on a lot of playfields I have seen. Usually though the starburst patterning helps disguise it. Those sheild inserts though, are as clear as day... and highlight any cracks...

 

I reckon it came up pretty good...

 

Cheers

Jacob

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Like I said the pic was before the cracking. None of the other inserts has any issues when we first clear coated the entire playfield, like I said the decal seems to protect the bare insert plastic.

 

I'll have to post another pic up of the pitting after sanding, its in no way what I'd consider fixed but I thought id post the effort anyway.

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thats a real shame mate.

 

Mylar is a name incorectly used for clear film and can actually be a number of differnt materials. The name Mylar is a brand name owned by Dupont for their PET.

I am not sure what those decals/inserts are made of but it could be:

 

PVC vinyl: (polyvinyl chloride) is a thermoplastic material which has a lower melting and expansion temp range. This will start to disort at very low temps. Its has the good printability. Because it is cheap it is often used in place of the others below when it shouldnt be.

 

Actetate: (cellulose acetate) this stuf is made from a polymer derived from wood pulp and cotton. It is common in printing because of its clarity but because it made from wood/cotton it doesnt like being near volatile copatings. It wil distort at 105c.

 

Mylar is Polyethylene Terephthalate (PET). It has the highest melt resistance and the best chemical resistance of all the films available but it does have a low heat/distortion range as well. Its a good all round material but the most expensive and most likely to be overlooked to save cost.

 

Prob didnt help much but just thought I would post about the name 'Mylar'

Edited by spacies
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thanks for posting this up, alot of great information!

I have never ever seen a STTNG without the hairline cracking on the green inserts, its just worse on some

I tell ya what, damn they looked nice uncracked! It's a shame they crack.. awesome lookin inserts imo :)

 

Thats actually something Savage said too, maybe using less hardener may have done the trick as you say.

I'm getting close to finishing Funhouse's touch ups so when I take it to Scott's we will do some experimentation.

I bought some of those peel and stick insert decals from Bay Area so we will use some of the unneeded stickers to test with one a piece of wood or something with different ratios of clear.

Another idea I have is maybe brushing some weak 2 pac over the peel and stick decals first after they have been applied before doing the whole PF.

 

Good write up.

 

So was it just those 3 inserts that had decals on them? Did you know they (the decals) were there before clearing?

 

Here's a good link for those interested in clearcoating over a full playfield decal.. Dont!

 

http://www.hassellcastle.com/ebd/index.htm

 

I'm not 100% sure how the insert decals are done all i know is there is something on top of the print. For example look at these arrow inserts from my funhouse and notice the lifting.

You can scratch the shit out of the top of these without damaging the print which is why I think there is a layer of something on top protecting the print.

 

http://aussiearcade.com/uploads/AK/funhouse/IMG_1293.jpg

 

I'm guessing the inserts are either glued in bare then screen over then something applied over top before clearing or perhaps the decals are printed separate then applied on top of the insert. All I know if Funhouse isn't cleared and the factory mylar did not cover all the inserts which suggests the print is protected.

Edited by Arcade King
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I remember in one of those TOP DVDs that Shaggy used an insert decal before a clearcoat but he cut out the letters only so there was as little decal as possible to reduce the risk of the decal delaminating after the clearcoat.

Not very practical on those arrow inserts with the black borders to worry about though.

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When I replaced the insert decals on my T2, I found that after removing old original decals, which I believe were diamond coated over the top (stand to be corrected here), the new decals were slightly thinner in thickness. Not a huge issue, but when applied, left a small gap / almost air bubble around the edge of PF and where the body of the decal hit the actual insert. I would have cut the decals down, but as they had a black border around the insert, this couldn't be done.

 

When I was looking into clearcoating the PF, my panel beater suggested this would cause problems, which is why I went with the mylar. :unsure

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Very strange problem.

 

Now thinking back, I think brushing the two pack on may be too much in the way of chemicals, thus the reaction, when fixing up the shrinkage...

 

Thinner in 2 pac is minimal (compare to acrylic) but the hardener is where it's around 2:1, 2 parts clear, 1 part hardener.

I'm not sure of the implications of less hardener, as this is the chemical reaction needed to cure. Maybe it won't set and be a jelly kind of set, which I wouldn't like to happen...

 

As Travis mention, most "Diamond Plated" clear coats have this problem...Unfortunately his was more pronounced.

 

I think, how I did my Indy may be the best way (I also think two coats may not be sufficient coverage, might be ok using High Solids clear)

 

Back to what I may think will work..

 

2-3 coats of clear, 1st coat as always is like a tac coat, to promote adhesion.

Then 2 normal coats. Dry for a week. Then sand with 800 - 1200 grit Wet Sand paper. And then 1 tac coat, and one good coat followed straight after (no waiting with another coat, usually referred to as a flow coat)...with another coat.

 

Of course, my plan for Travis's STTNG is sand back with 800 - 1200 and do the 1 tac, 1 normal, then the flow coat....

 

Of course no charge!... but bring some stubbies ;)

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Found this long long old thread on RGP discussing clear coating. Some of it is worth reading, some not...

 

Some interesting posts from that link from page 1

 

quote

 

I'm dead set against clear coating, I anticipate 20 years from now

collectors desparate to locate pins that were not "improved" in this manner.

 

Just the other day, on Antiques Roadshow a man showed up with $20,000

collection of comics whose value he ruined back in the day by preserving

them with an accepted (at the time) spray on to protect the covers.

 

First rule of restoration is do no harm, and make no permament alteration.

 

I know some well respected people swear by it, but I think they'll be proven

wrong long after they're gone.

 

Other problems are the increased speed, which is detrimental to plastics and

playfield. Not too mention it's just too damn shiny for EM's.

 

A nice coat of Butchers wax (clear, available ay many hardware stores) is

perfect, hard as a rock and easily removed with naptha or goof off.

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Interesting reading, as for the prospect of devaluing it by clear coating... pffft pinballs aren't to me as valuable collectibles you keep to hope to sell later on for a profit...

They're meant to be played and enjoyed!, Collectors looking at pinballs in the purist form I don't care about so clearing to me is more preserving it longer to enjoy more... But that's my opionion...

 

At the moment, my TZ isn't clear coated, waxed well and I can't see any real increase in speed or damage to plastics from the clear coat...(been cleared for close to 3 years now)

 

But we're not talking EM's here, which maybe a totally different ball game.. EMs seem to get more attention of purists, but any touching up would then affect the collect-ability I would think..

Also getting off track, this is about issues with 2-pac clear, and if there's a fix for the insert lifting prob...

Hopefully the Super Glue and different attack in clearing will provide better results...

 

I'm not far from fixing the clearing my GnR playfield...

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playfields do not have decals

 

bare timber with glued in inserts

then sanded and a primer applied

then screen printed

then cleared

 

That's what I thought too?

 

I assume what looks like a decal is the clear coat getting peeled off the insert, and pulling the silk screened art with them...

 

Perhaps it is the primer that is the key to successful clear coating - or is the primer only applied to wood where artwork is screened?

 

Cheers

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When I replaced the insert decals on my T2, I found that after removing old original decals, which I believe were diamond coated over the top (stand to be corrected here), the new decals were slightly thinner in thickness. Not a huge issue, but when applied, left a small gap / almost air bubble around the edge of PF and where the body of the decal hit the actual insert. I would have cut the decals down, but as they had a black border around the insert, this couldn't be done.

 

I had the opposite problem... the decals I bought from eBay were rather thick, so when it was cleared there was a small 'lip' left around them. The clear probably wasn't thick enough / not enough coats.

I only used them on one or two inserts... the rest eg Arrows in clock I just did by hand = much better.

 

 

While we're at it, I'll post up all the info I found on RGP when I was researching clearcoating. Take what information you think is relevant! Use at you're own risk!

 

After you've scrubbed the PF as clean as it gets with Naphtha, take

600 grit sandpaper and dry thumb sand entire surface until you have an

even flat matt finish, use a little extra effort on the ball trails

etc. go VERY light on the plastic inserts. If you have any depressions

in the PF, now's the time to fix them! No..... clear coating won't

make up for a rough PF, if anything it will make it worse, I find

these usually around worn PF plastic inserts. I touch up the paint,

and then lay some water thick super glue on top of it to raise the

depression, I can't emphasize this enough. Let me repeat CLAERCOATING

WILL NOT FIX THIS!!! After it's all done put some 600 grit on a

sanding block and smooth out the entire PF. The reason I thumb sand

first is a sanding block doesn't get the uneven areas as well, but

does a better job of smoothing. Next use an air compressor and blow as

much sanding dust out of the cracks especially plastic light inserts

as possible, then get a clean rag and wipe down thoroughly with

Naphtha, up, down all around, MAKE ABSOLUTLY SURE THERE IS NO Sanding

dust or grease on the PF, THIS WILL BE THE LAST TIME TO CLEAN!!! Now

touchup the paint with a water base acrylic, make sure to color match

or all your efforts will be for not!! Clear coating will not fix a bad

color match! Put a clean rag down to rest you hand on (You don't want

oil from you hand on the PF since there will be no more cleaning and

any oil will fisheye when you shoot the clear coat and that SUCKS!)

 

 

Now take the PF to and auto paint shop and pay $50 to have them clear

coat it for you (make sure they only wipe it with a tack cloth one

final time to get rid of dust, Tell them not to use any liquid or

they'll remove your water based paint, often they do this to remove

oil, but, you've already done it.) They have the equipment and

expertise and Automotive clear coat is a much harder material than

Varathane, The difference is NIGHT and DAY. You will only need 2 or 3

coats and it will be fully cured in a couple of days versus a month

for Varathane. "VARATHANE IS FOR AMATURES!!!!" I mean no disrespect

for those who have done it, I have too. It does look better then

before, but not as good as it could and with no additional effort.

 

 

When you get your PF back it will look awesome!! Don't be tempted to

stop there, (It gets MUCH better!)Take some 2000 grit sand paper and a

spray bottle of water and lightly wet thumb sand the entire PF (Don't

over wet!), especially areas where you see imperfections (hairs, dust,

orange peel etc) then use a sanding block and 2000 grit and wet sand

everything LIGHTLY!! Now your PF is going to lose its shine and look

like crap. Don't worry, it's only temporary! Get a (preferred) high

speed circular buffer with a new (Or very clean) simulated wool pad,

(but an orbital buffer and wool pad will work in a pinch) and some

very fine rubbing compound, I use "McGuire's Swirl Ease" but any Fine

compound should work. Not all rubbing compound is the same, some is

courser than others. Don't use Novus 2 or 3. Novus 3 is too course and

Novus 2 has no cutting agent! Also be very careful, there may be

splinters sticking up (around the plastic starpost holes etc.) If a

high speed circular buffer with wool pad catches a splinter it could

rip a strip of wood right off!!!! It's generally safe to do the main

areas without fear. WHEN YOU FINISH YOU'RE PLAYFIELD WILL LOOK LIKE

GLASS!!!.

 

Yes, go lightly. You will only need to sand with 600 grit if you are going to clearcoat the whole playfield afterwards. That's so it will give the clear a good surface to bond with. If the playfield is too smooth, the clearcoat won't adhere as well to playfield. You want the surface block sanded fairly level as well.

 

As long as you have cleaned the whole playfield really well with Novus 2, you then lightly sand it with 600 grit.

You don't want to scuff up the original paint work too much at all. The clear will cover all pores as long as they are very fine.

 

The "fun" part will be the touch ups. Trying to match the colours properly. It is hard. Colours look similar but can dry lighter or darker. Then clearcoating will sometimes darken it more. So good to practice on small pieces of scrap wood. Use similar grain timber off cuts first and see how colours match when paint dries. This will be the most time consuming part of it all. Take your time through this whole process as this will be the most crucial part of the restore. I can't stress this point enough. Take your time with this process. The rewards will be greater.

 

Is it only a few areas you need touchups? Like are they confined close by?

What type of paints are you using? Try not to use sharpie pens either. Use black paint and go steady.

You will have to try and level the playfield before clearing also. But keep away from your touchups. If you have to level touchups, lightly use wet/dry 1200 grit.

 

I went thru the SAME thing with F-14, except that only about 8 original

inserts were left ok. Get the decals. I had excellent results, and I'd say

I'm lucky and had the best case scenario experience. What I did with any

inserts that need the decal:

 

If the old insert ink and clearcoat are peeled up, the insert will no longer

be flush with the playfield. I wouldn't recommend putting the decal on like

this, or you'll have an air pocket around the entire edge of the insert,

under the decal.

 

Heat the insert from the bottom with a hair dryer or heat gun on the lower

setting. Too hot CAN warp an insert. Guess how I know (looked convex from

the top).. Push it up and out from the bottom. Clean the glue from the

hole in the pf and from the insert itself. Scrape the old remaining

paint/ink from the top of the insert. Wet sand it so that there's no more

ink, it's perfectly flat, and slick (so that the decal will stick well). I

did this by putting a piece of 400 grit wet dry paper down on the counter

(flat) near the sink, flipping the insert plastic over and sanding smooth,

then on to 800 grit. It should be smooth, clean looking, with no divits in

it(I had some from scraping gone bad).

 

Reglue the insert into the pf. Google search for recommended glue. I used

Elmer's yellow carpenter glue. Use a flat block to level it, so that it

dries flush with the surrounding playfield.

 

Wait a day, then touch up the paint around the insert as needed, mostly

black in my case. Block that smooth, if needed. I found it useful to

dilute the black paint with water, so that it goes on super thin and dries

flatter.

 

When you're satisfied with that, apply the decal.

 

I touched up, sanded with 600 grit the whole playfield..then sprayed 3 coats

of an automotive urethane clear coat. I don't see how the decals would

really work, without clearcoating over them. If clearcoating, make sure to

use a scotchbrite pad, if needed, so that there no shiny spot left on the

playfield, including those insert decals. The clear must have a scuffed

surface to bite to!!! I wiped it down with Naptha 3 or 4 times. I had NO

lifting or fisheyes. I think it was partly luck.

 

BTW.. I actually DID remove, sand flat, and reglue every single insert on

the game, except for the 8 or so that had the ink intact. I think it was

the right move. From the point of view of playing the game, it's hard to

tell which is original and which a decal

 

I had my FH done with absolutely no fish-eye or other problems. I was taught

that it's very important to sand (600 grit) before touch-up, then copious

cleaning with Naphtha and...here's a key..to lean your hands and elbows on

clean rags while doing touch-ups to make sure no body oils get on the

surface because that's what causes the fish-eyes. All the body shop should

do is run a tack cloth before shooting. The following day, wet-sand with

2000 grit then high speed buffing with fine rubbing compound. Worked great

for me.

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Some interesting posts from that link from page 1

 

quote

 

I'm dead set against clear coating, I anticipate 20 years from now

collectors desparate to locate pins that were not "improved" in this manner.

 

Just the other day, on Antiques Roadshow a man showed up with $20,000

collection of comics whose value he ruined back in the day by preserving

them with an accepted (at the time) spray on to protect the covers.

 

First rule of restoration is do no harm, and make no permament alteration.

 

I know some well respected people swear by it, but I think they'll be proven

wrong long after they're gone.

 

Other problems are the increased speed, which is detrimental to plastics and

playfield. Not too mention it's just too damn shiny for EM's.

 

A nice coat of Butchers wax (clear, available ay many hardware stores) is

perfect, hard as a rock and easily removed with naptha or goof off.

 

 

Is a point i have often discussed with other collectors. seems to be this wave of thought at the moment that we should all be clear coating and that your pf should be perfect to look at as though still straight from the factory.

I strongly disagree, first up - no restoration should be done unless it is absolutely necessary, if the paint is flaking off badly and so it is being lost by the ball roll, then you have no choice but to restore as it is quite clear that nothing will be left if you continue to play.

99% of restoration is a crap job done, touching up the pf with paint that doesnt quite match is worse than leaving it alone. Then it gets clear coated and sealed in. So now its totally fu*#ed!

 

If you dont have the skills to do the job right, then dont do it.

if you do, then leave the pf in a condition where someone else can come in after you and do a better job.

 

I couldnt agree more with the quotes above - years from now, collectors will be screaming for pins that havent had the touch ups that we all seem to be doing.

Original is ALWAYS best.

 

Rules are;

 

Dont do it unless its absolutely necessary

allow scope for a better job down the track.

 

Clear coating for the sake of it is stupidity. it is only necessary if the game is destined for the dump due to its condition. You then have no choice but to do a total restore - by all means CC it. It seals the work and will preserve it.

The original pin got lost during the damage that it had - nothing to lose here.

 

There was a time back in the 70's - 80's where cabinets were being painted brown, presumably to match the curtains or something stupid. Now this is considered heresy. Im quite sure that practises that we do today will be frowned upon in years to come.

We stress over "classic"pins being in original condition. takes a good 20 years for a pin to be labelled classic really - bear that in mind when touching up your pf.

 

When restoring, you have 2 choices,

 

make it look new again

touch up where necessary but retain the years of use look and prevent further damage.

 

In both cases - the work should be invisible. If i can see where its touched up - its a crap job. Go sealing this in with CC and its bloody ruined.

 

 

....my 2c worth... do i need a flame suit???

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I agree somewhat.

 

I think if you have to repaint worn areas then CC is essential (mine was worn to wood, and I repainted 80% of the PF, so CC was a definate!).

 

Diamond coated PF's with a minor touchup wouldn't really need a full CC.

 

Older machines... probably a personal preference.

 

hmm still a tough call.

 

I totally agree that if you can't do it (restore) properly, don't do it at all... esp. if it will make it worse.

My EM backglass was 'touched up' by someone using aerosol spray cans, and when it came for me to do touch ups, I just had to leave those areas :(

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I do resent the coment 'Clear coating for the sake of it is stupidity' maybe to you, but to me it isn't if done right. After all, this is what Diamond Playfiles are, and what Wayne is doing with new produced playfields.

You got your opinion and thats fine.. Not once have i had a go at anyone for either clearing or not clearing etc..

 

But with this comet "99% of restoration is a crap job done, touching up the pf with paint that doesnt quite match is worse than leaving it alone. Then it gets clear coated and sealed in. So now its totally fu*#ed!"

 

So where do you get this stat from, I really hate when people throw in stats and then don't show any substance..

C'mon 99% of restorations is crap, gotta be joking....

 

Going through restores from this site, most and I mean most touch ups I;ve seen are great...

 

And with a touch up being done wrong then clearing over, then being fu*#ed!", I doubt it.... My Indy, yes had holes in the playfield, and I don't believe in just spraying dabs of clear here and there, the clear will eventually get an edge doing this... But my first attempt, the colour was out.. Was I screwed, not at all.. Sanded the clear down, re went over the area and lo and behold fixed... My motto is, there is nothing that can't be fixed....

 

If you're after something to hold value than there's stamps :p

 

And really I couldn't care less if a collector say my pins and scoffed that they had been cleared... I'd be thankful they are still working in 20 year, and that also I'll be still around :lol

 

You forgot the 3rd option, don;t touch it at all. This is to me is what collectors would be more after, if they want original, then I would expect them to have nothing touched up, repaired or anything...

 

I'd also put down, applying new stickers, extras, translite, gold plating or anything like this as a negative to a collector, but to an enthusiast a plus..

 

 

Anyway, not flaming anyone, and not calling any one stupid for doing one thing or another as it's to each ones personal taste....

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But with this comet "99% of restoration is a crap job done, touching up the pf with paint that doesnt quite match is worse than leaving it alone. Then it gets clear coated and sealed in. So now its totally fu*#ed!"

 

So where do you get this stat from, I really hate when people throw in stats and then don't show any substance..

C'mon 99% of restorations is crap, gotta be joking....

 

No - im serious. There are only a few good restores done but plenty of heavy handed people prepared to strut their stuff with this. yep, there are some really good restores on this site, but this site represents a minute amount of people who own pins. For all the pins in OZ - how many are owned by members of this site? Of course we dont know, but can only hazard a guess. And not all the restores i see on this site are what i would consider to be good - i see good attempts but not necessarily good results.,

If you are picking at the number 99%, then i would consider that as perdantic. Its an expression of term used to highlight that there are only a few good restores compared to all restores.

 

 

You forgot the 3rd option, don;t touch it at all.

 

 

Quite sure i placed this option first with;

 

Original is ALWAYS best.

 

Rules are;

 

Dont do it unless its absolutely necessary.

 

yes - its each to their own. its your pin - do what the hell you like with it.

Whether the clear coat fad will prove to be a blessing in the future remains to be seen. The point i am trying to make is that if its not necessary then why do it?

But i do know of collectors who are already licking their lips at the thought of their classic woodrail in original condition including a few scrapes being highly sought after in years to come as it HASNT been CC'd or touched up.

 

Look at Raphael Lankars site - all those pins beautifully restored to museum quality. Repaints abound. yes, they are minty and exquisite to look at, but is their value more than the value of an untouched minty one? Absolutely not.

Check out the listings on the collectors register,

how many list repro Bg from Shay - why did they list that? Because original is best and a repro will always be a repro.

 

Im not trying to get up your nose, but i wish people would think a bit more before CCing a pf. If you have to restore then by all means, but to CC just because you can, i dont agree with - it was already good the way it was made, as it was intended.

 

Yes, ive CC'd before and will again - i also do a lot of restore work, but its done when the thing is close to a write off or the decay has set in and so CC to prevent further.

Eventually, there will be 2 types of pin - original ones and those that got touched up and CC'd. The choice is yours and im not meaning to bag you for that.

Im as guilty as the next person, im just about to post here about a fully restored pf and repainted cabinet. I wish i hadnt had to do it, but the cab had already been painted to look more presentable yet the artwork underneath was more than acceptable and the pf was a write off with no repro to be had. So is it a parts machine or restore? I chose restore and CC to seal.

 

But in all honesty people are CCing when its not needed. Will they stand up over time??

 

Read my post in 20 years

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That's what I thought too?

 

I assume what looks like a decal is the clear coat getting peeled off the insert, and pulling the silk screened art with them...

 

Perhaps it is the primer that is the key to successful clear coating - or is the primer only applied to wood where artwork is screened?

 

Cheers

 

whats on top of the funhouse inserts then? as I said not all inserts are protected by Mylar.

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black letters are screen printed onto the inserts when the playfield is screened

 

I am not saying you cant use aftermarket insert decals to repair damaged playfields, but what happens is the clear coat takes off the letters that are screened onto the inserts/playfields.

 

you also need to make sure the playfield is scratched up with sand paper before clearing, if you ever see someone polish floorboards,

 

they use a sealer then sand between coats.

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