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New issues with playfields surface....


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Bruce at amd told me that they unbox and check machines (I don’t know what they check and may only be le’s as that was what I was discussing at the time).

 

I haven’t yet asked but does anyone know if they’d classify these blisters as defects?

 

From the jp2 posts on pinside it seems that machines can be delivered and are cosmetically perfect but within a few days of play can exhibit these issues (sling rubber + coil activations causing extra pressure on posts perhaps?)

 

Given the time they sit on a ship for aus stock could these issues present themselves right out of the box?

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

There was a lot of anxiety with gb too. I had guys worry and ask similar questions when talking to me. Worry about if it happens. Stern/amd handled the issue well and I got a replacement pf eventually. The bonus was I could play my game to death while waiting for the new pf and then have a brand new machine again.

 

If it is as bad as people think, stern will probably replace it.

 

Stern being tight lipped about it is normal for a business. They need to investigate it, work out how bad it is, formulate an action plan, assign blame etc etc before communicating with amd, who in turn will contact affected clients. Otherwise what do people expect them to say?

 

"there's an issue, we don't know how to fix it, it's now your problem", that's not gonna help, so give it a little time. Gb took about 6 months to resolve and my game was playable right up to the swap.

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  • 2 weeks later...
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Stern hasn't publically announced it anywhere.

It's actually done at 2 different locations.... one company cuts the playfields, hammers the inserts in, and sands it back..... then they are sent elsewhere for the art to be printed (no longer silkscreened) and then clear coated (now uses water-based clear).

 

Apparently the "good oil" says that Mirco make ALL playfields now.... :lol

 

Also now seems like this is being "reported" as a predominantly JJP issue? ... I guess that must mean for Stern "cleargate" it is not an "issue", ie. "normal"? :unsure

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Apparently the "good oil" says that Mirco make ALL playfields now.... :lol

 

Also now seems like this is being "reported" as a predominantly JJP issue? ... I guess that must mean for Stern "cleargate" it is not an "issue", ie. "normal"? :unsure

 

Its a bigger Issue for Stern

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Something like Homepin's overlay system might be an option in the future if they can't get the modern materials to work

 

Rather accept the current problems with clear coats than substitute for that type of artwork overlay. The only place for that is in the reproduction world of restorations. Besides light doesn't diffuse through as effectively as a proper jeweled diffused insert.

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Rather accept the current problems with clear coats than substitute for that type of artwork overlay. The only place for that is in the reproduction world of restorations. Besides light doesn't diffuse through as effectively as a proper jeweled diffused insert.

 

And it looks shit. And a bugger to get rid of ball trails

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Something like Homepin's overlay system might be an option in the future if they can't get the modern materials to work

 

This is what I came to the thread to say :) I have two games I use playfield protectors on and one I don't, I can't tell the difference in ball roll. Get the protectors dialled with artwork printed on them then make the playfields out of sheet metal, sell the games with a spare protector to be installed after 20,000 games when it wears out.

 

Problem solved forever :)

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  • 3 weeks later...

Are people here holding off buying new machines at the present, until there is some sort of confirmation the playfield issues have been fixed? Or are you still buying them and either not bothered by the issues, or simply just taking a chance on the machine?

 

Has anyone received a repro playfield from Mirco recently since these issues have arisen, that can confirm there are no issues with the clear? I am reading so many mixed reports on Pinside..:unsure

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Are people here holding off buying new machines at the present, until there is some sort of confirmation the playfield issues have been fixed? Or are you still buying them and either not bothered by the issues, or simply just taking a chance on the machine?

 

Has anyone received a repro playfield from Mirco recently since these issues have arisen, that can confirm there are no issues with the clear? I am reading so many mixed reports on Pinside..:unsure

 

Yeah im holding off on Jurassic park because of the issue just waiting to see what happens

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I have recently bought a Star Trek pro final voyage and iron maiden premium, both need new playfields, my distributor has agreed to give my money back but we’ve both decided to wait and see if stern are going to come up with some sort of resolve. I really want these two titles in my line up. I had planned to buy a Munsters pro and Elvira premium but not until the machines I already have are sorted. Hugely disappointing. My advice to anyone buying a new stern is wait until they can make quality machines again. Splitting cabinets, node board problems, playfields crapping out! And we keep buying them??
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I have recently bought a Star Trek pro final voyage and iron maiden premium, both need new playfields, my distributor has agreed to give my money back but we’ve both decided to wait and see if stern are going to come up with some sort of resolve. I really want these two titles in my line up. I had planned to buy a Munsters pro and Elvira premium but not until the machines I already have are sorted. Hugely disappointing. My advice to anyone buying a new stern is wait until they can make quality machines again. Splitting cabinets, node board problems, playfields crapping out! And we keep buying them??

 

Mate sorry to hear, at least your distributor has agreed to give your money back, that is pretty huge in itself.

 

Can i ask what playfield issues your machines have in particular, do you have any pics?

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My guess is the water base clear is the issue, The mix aint right, multiple layers that are unable to cure properly.

Also I think the air tools they use on the assembly line are too highly torqued.

 

I'm sorry to hear some of our local guys are getting problem games :(

I have seen some of the photo's numerous machines and its certainly a major concern.

Some Maiden one's I have seen are really bad. Such a shame.

 

Bruce is doing he's best and as mentioned Stern will look at issues on a case by case basis.

Still not much fun having to do a playfield swap.

 

Even Hitler as having a hard time with this issue !

 

https://captiongenerator.com/1498452/Hitler-Buys-a-Stern-Jurassic-Park

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Pinball haus is selling post protectors from titan that I'm guessing are rubber buffers between of and post. I wonder if they would relieve the issue if caught early @BioBa

 

Not quite sure what you mean by "post protectors"? I sell sling shot protectors but have not seen ot heard of post protectors?

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Just buy them and play them.

 

Really? if you bought a new car and the paint fell off after a couple of drives would you be satisfied and just drive it?

 

I retract what I said about playfield protectors above because it has been stated that they don't help with this issue and the clear and art will still chip away under the protector.

 

Yep there are different levels of how much this has affected some people, but that is not an excuse to be totally dismissive IMO.

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Bruce at amd told me that they unbox and check machines (I don’t know what they check and may only be le’s as that was what I was discussing at the time).

 

I haven’t yet asked but does anyone know if they’d classify these blisters as defects?

 

From the jp2 posts on pinside it seems that machines can be delivered and are cosmetically perfect but within a few days of play can exhibit these issues (sling rubber + coil activations causing extra pressure on posts perhaps?)

 

Given the time they sit on a ship for aus stock could these issues present themselves right out of the box?

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

Apparently AMD do but not check well in my situation as I purchased a new B66 (late 2018) and got it home, played 6 games on the same day and after the excitement of a new game and then checked the game closer to learn the rules and inserts features etc on the same day noticed bubbling / pooling clear around posts and where the apron meets the playfield to the point that if you push it with your finger and the bubble moves around = art / clear separation from the playfield. So yes regardless of travel it is fresh out of the box.

 

I know a few people with these issues and it appears to be where the clear coat is over art and not necessarily over clear over the timber finish which points to the issue being a reaction / separation between the printed ink and the clearcoat.

 

When I contacted AMD they were good from one perspective that they said if you are not happy return it for a full refund but would not re-imburse the costs for freight which under Aus law they should but did not want to cause dramas as I wanted to purchase games in the future but was a $500 loss straight up for the freight costs. I do worry for the next person if they got my old machine or if the game was fixed. I was on the list for Munsters but all communication stopped after the B66 return so I'm probably black listed now - sad but I suppose something for your guys to consider.

 

Regardless of what the Stern Warranty is the Australian Fair Trading law protects you from defective products like blistering, pooling, lifting artwork as this is defective and some of my US friends have had IM populated playfields replaced similar to the GB replacement program but Stern never makes this very public. There are a couple of people that went the rubber washer suggestions and they still have issues will rippling now occurring wider out.

 

For you guys buying new games I would be nervous about new purchases like the Elvira LE and Signatures as even with the recent Jurassic's they moved the art and black outline more away from the posts to avoid the issue but some hidden posts left and pooling started again and you have to wonder what will happen to these playfields in a few years time as you won't have Consumer Affairs rights by then.

 

I was talking to a mate who was a spray painter and now an automotive paint seller and he believes that it is the new eco friendly acrylic paints & clears and they need alot of things to go right - chemical reaction, humidity and environment and time to cure between colour and clears - they need to be similar product brands etc. It has to make you wonder given that chemical reactions etc have to be perfect between the direct to playfield printer ink and clearcoat recipe - has to be perfect.

 

Here are some comments from the auto industry - on acrylic versus urethane

 

https://www.thomasnet.com/articles/plastics-rubber/urethane-acrylic-automotive/

and this one talks of arcylic clears chipping

https://www.hemmings.com/blog/article/acrylic-vs-urethane/

 

then when you read into it the acrylic clears need a suitable base to bite in so a printed playfield artwork / inks may have negative reactions to an acrylic clear.

 

I created a few alternatives to minimize the issue and hide any pooling for the interim but installing these may void any Stern / JJP warranty so just be aware. I make no money form these (but Shapeways do) BUT if you become a Shapeways member you can download the STL files for free and print your own - just trying to help.

 

https://www.shapeways.com/marketplace?type=product&q=swinkspooling

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