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bwodie
3rd July 2006, 02:38 PM
Hey guys,

well picked up my first pinny, its a little rough cause of these few problems, but i got it for a bargain.
I been reading up on http://www.marvin3m.com/wpc so i can get a bit of a technical background on it all.
I'm having 3 problems.

1. when i picked up the machine, the auto plunger (is this what its commonly called?) e.g the gun with button ya press to launch the ball worked fine. got it home, it no longer works. has now defaulted to right flipper for ball llaunch which is crap. i reconnected all the ribbon cables which didnt help. I dont know what most people call this part, so upon reading through marvins site i couldnt find any details on trouble shooting.

2. random multiballs
i have been reading on marvins site and will check what he recommends before i get to worried. thing is, im doubtfull of the vibration sympton, because it seems to happen worst on your first ball, and its alot better after that. weird.

3. about half the time, when a game finishes and the game over comes up, there is a loud ****in bang! its not coming from the speakers, and its louder than the normal bangs that come from the machine.. thinking about it, it sounds the same as the coils (is that right?) going off but twice as loud. it scares the hell outta me and i dont think its right lol

anyways, now i got this pinny, im really ****in addicted. i love it so much. when i was younger i was only into arcade cabs, but being a big movie buff and loving this shit, i can see me buying loads more.
thanks heaps for any help

hamish_nz
3rd July 2006, 02:57 PM
1. Check the connector for the gun in the front of the cabinet

2. Are two balls coming out of the shooter lane at once?

3. When you finish a game the last two numbers of your score are matched against a random number. If they match the you get a free ball. This is signaled by a knocker(coil which hits the cabinet) your "Loud bang".
Have a look at the display next time for the numbers

bwodie
3rd July 2006, 04:16 PM
firstly, thanks heaps for your fast reply mate :)
am at work atm, will check the connector at the front of the cabinet.

2. thats a good question.. i have a feeling so.. but its definatly thinking its a multi ball because it comes up on the matrix display..
sometimes two balls are thrown in there.. sometimes its one after another sometimes within a second somtimes within 10
will watch this afternoon for more detail.

3. i havent noticed a free ball after the bang but will definatly check that. it does indeed come from the side of the cabinet.. top right i THINK

thanks again

MadMikeAU
3rd July 2006, 05:38 PM
...
3. When you finish a game the last two numbers of your score are matched against a random number. If they match the you get a free ball. This is signaled by a knocker(coil which hits the cabinet) your "Loud bang".
Have a look at the display next time for the numbers

I always thought that it gave you a free credit. If so, and he is playing free play, he might not notice any difference. It should say MATCH or something.

hamish_nz
3rd July 2006, 05:42 PM
Match
A free game given away by the machine to one of the players for no apparent reason at the end of the game. There is around a 10% chance of receiving a match on older games, but newer solid-state machines allow this to be set as low as 1%, with the factory setting at 7%. *When a match occurs, the knocker is usually used to inform the player

bwodie
3rd July 2006, 06:50 PM
yah playing free play
and i think you guys are right
it hasnt happened again, and ive been watching the "match" and i havent won yet.
so thats that solved, mind you, god damn its loud!

2. it aint 2 balls at once, it really does think you get multiball, and they come out one at a time in quick succession... theres definatly something wrong wiring wise because i checked the cables at the auto plunger end, and they are all fine. also on the play field, there is 5 lights goin upright, 250k, 500k, 1 mill etc etc
they go backwards... the light starts at 2 mill and 256 k comes up on the screen so instead of advancing from bottom to top, it goes backwards lol

so frustrating, i cant stop playin the game regardless though :D

Shock_And_Awe
3rd July 2006, 07:14 PM
I think they talk about this problem (the multiball problem) in This Old Pinball #5 when they're working on an Indy?? Is anyone else familiar with this? I haven't watched it in a while but I am sure they discussed this and how to fix it.

*edit * just checked the dvd and it was a trough problem if 2 balls came out at once into the shooter lane I think what Hamish was suggesting at. That not being the case I have no idea.

bwodie
3rd July 2006, 09:45 PM
awwwwwww
wish i knew someone close by in newcastle that could fix these things for less than a fortune lol
everyones help so far has been greatly appreciated!

The Pinny Parlour
3rd July 2006, 09:54 PM
I'm no good with pinball help, but just wanted to chime in to congratulate you on your first pinball. I want that to happen to me shortly. :D

bretty
3rd July 2006, 10:19 PM
also on the play field, there is 5 lights goin upright, 250k, 500k, 1 mill etc etc
they go backwards... the light starts at 2 mill and 256 k comes up on the screen so instead of advancing from bottom to top, it goes backwards lol


just a suggestion but the board under the playfield for those lights may have been put upside down while changing globes at some stage.Cant recall the setup under that playfield but if its just those 5 lights on the board it could be :unsure

bwodie
4th July 2006, 08:03 AM
haha thanks pinny parlour!

good idea!
will rotate it this arvo after work :)

Orlando Ortiz
4th July 2006, 11:14 AM
The random multiball bug was fixed in the later ROM revisions... you can get a replacement eprom from John Wart Jr. of www.myhomegameroom.com

He' s great!

I have the same pinball machine, mine needs a new display and a new DMD controller. Oh well... lovely game :-)

bwodie
4th July 2006, 11:26 AM
i dont think its just a general bug tho orlando cause it does it every time i play it without fail..
every first ball and usualy at least once or twice after that

mooncresta
4th July 2006, 06:53 PM
he could be right check u6 eprom if it has L-8 on it its current.

Orlando Ortiz
5th July 2006, 03:43 AM
or check the rec.games.pinball on google groups (or your favorite newsgroups server) for archived info on how to fix that :)

bwodie
5th July 2006, 07:56 AM
yah i did a search on the group, but the only one post that had a random multiball problem was completely diff to mine
i rotated the board with the lights and that fixed that up, so great job there guys :D
now mooncresta..
what does "u6 eprom if it has L-8" mean in laymens terms lol

also i ran the test at startup so i could get some more info

tells me to check both of these
switch 34 - grip trigger
switch 72 target 2

now i found my instruction manual under the playfield so looked up where these connected at the back board, and checked they were plugged in correctly.. re seated them if possible and it looked fine.. :S

mooncresta
5th July 2006, 08:40 AM
u6 is location number on cpu board.on the eprom(i.c) should have a sticker on it with possibly L-8 on it.

Skybeaux
5th July 2006, 09:26 AM
Hi Bwodie,

If it turns out you need a level- 8 revision game rom i can sell you one for $12 including postage. I've also got profanity roms for Terminator 2 aswell.

bwodie
5th July 2006, 10:22 AM
****in great first post skybeaux! lol
thanks mate, will let you know!
and welcome to the forums
gunna check that out this arvey mooncresta

Daring33
5th July 2006, 02:23 PM
As you have 2 switches coming up in the test mode it's time to get the manual out and check the switch matrix.

First check that the switches that give the error are on the the same row or column, if they are, then it's time to check all of the others on the same row/column. First check that they are all connected (no loose wires, broken solder) on both the switches that are giving the errors and the rest on that same row or column.

It's hard to believe but one of the working switches may have a wire off and this can bugger up the rest in the same row.

I spent hours checking the ones that were coming up in the test, but it was one that was working on that row that had a wire off, quick solder and the 6 others worked!

Put the game in switch test mode and manually roll the ball over all the switches concerned.

Good luck!

The Pinny Parlour
5th July 2006, 02:38 PM
Hi Bwodie,

If it turns out you need a level- 8 revision game rom i can sell you one for $12 including postage. I've also got profanity roms for Terminator 2 aswell.


Hi Skybeaux and Welcome to Aussie Arcade

Have fun around here and throw in yer 2 cents worth were possible.

Cheers & Enjoy
Ian

bwodie
5th July 2006, 03:08 PM
thanks for taking the time to reply daring mate!
going to try this out this afternoon before the footy :)

DKong
6th July 2006, 01:33 AM
My money is on the grip trigger switch! (34)

That would explain the multi ball problem!


Hi Bwodie,

If it turns out you need a level- 8 revision game rom i can sell you one for $12 including postage. I've also got profanity roms for Terminator 2 aswell.

Hi there..Just a question on the profanity roms..I installed these but can only get the graphic rom to work ie (it say's on the DMD F#$K you A$$h*le) but when I install the sound profanity I lose all sound ?? Switched back to the L-8 sound rom and it works fine with the profanity graphic chip but does not actually say the profanity through the speaker? Could I have a faulty sound rom for profanity?
cheers buddy and welcome!

Skybeaux
6th July 2006, 08:58 AM
Hi DKong,

Am i right that you only changed the U14 sound chip and got no sound ?

I think that the other two sound chips ( U15 and U18 ) should be sound level 3 to be compatible with the U14 profanity sound chip, otherwise it may not work.
But then the U14 profanity chip may be a dud like you said.

bwodie
7th July 2006, 12:02 PM
right,
so the U6 rom says LA2
i guess this is not a good start?
going to try everyone elses input with the trigger shortly :D

bwodie
7th July 2006, 04:43 PM
right so i checked the switches manually
every switch on the same row as the grip trigger is working fine..
when i click the trigger, its not showing up on the switch matrix
there is a diode at the trigger end, how can i test if thats ok..
got a multimeter.. just how do i do it lol
still stumped with the random multiball.. im now suspect its not infact multiball. i had a strange delusion it would pop multiball on the screen when it did it, but it doesnt..
it sometimes throws one ball in, it sometimes throws 2..
ive watched people playing the machine over and over and cannot see a pattern to when it does it
only suspect thing is, when im on the switch matrix, if i hold the right flipper in, it blinks, where as all the others stay solid
dont know if that could have anything to do with it?

DKong
7th July 2006, 06:19 PM
[QUOTE=bwodie]
there is a diode at the trigger end, how can i test if thats ok..
got a multimeter.. just how do i do it lol
/QUOTE]

quote from http://marvin3m.com/begin/

Testing Diodes.
A diode can not always be tested in-circuit. Often (but not always) one lead of the diode needs to be remove (unsolder) from the circuit board to get a good test. This also applies to testing coil diodes (one diode lead needs to be removed from the coil). When testing diodes, use the diode test of the DMM.

Put the black lead of the DMM on the banded side of the diode, and the red lead on the non-banded side. A reading between .4 and .8 volts should be seen. If a reading outside this range is noted, remove one lead of the diode from the circuit and test again. If still getting a reading outside of this range, then the diode is probably bad.

Switch the leads of the DMM (red lead on the banded side of the diode), and a null or zero reading should be seen on the DMM. If getting a different reading, remove one end of the diode from the circuit board and test again. If a null reading is not seen, the diode is bad.

end quote


I would also check the trough assembly switches, check them in the Switch Edges Test. The test should indicate all trough switches are close if the balls are removed from the playfield.
This is a big cause of the mutliple balls entering the playfield.
Hope this helps! It's a great game!

bwodie
7th July 2006, 06:36 PM
will do, thanks again dkong :)

trough left center and right are all closed when balls are out

DKong
7th July 2006, 07:26 PM
will do, thanks again dkong :)

trough left center and right are all closed when balls are out

Hmmm...The Outhole switch is working correctly right as you checked all switches on that matrix..

I would probally now be looking at that right flipper..going to have a quick look at mine to refresh!

Outhole switch 18 should be open

Grip trigger switch 34 should be open and should show up in your single switch test

BTW I always have the check error for switch 71 (the row of 4 - targets) and it's never effected gameplay. Just doesn't get hit for quite a while so the machine asks to check it.

bwodie
1st August 2006, 11:05 AM
right so firstly i have to give a HUUUUUUUUUGE thanks to DialogPimp.
He has sat on msn with me 2 nights in a row, all up for around 2-3 hours, troubleshooting my machine. I cant start to say how thankfull i am to him for sitting and wasting his personal time to help a stranger fix a pinny. Then yesterday i received mail from him, with some bits of rubber from clark rubber to put behind my targets. what a fella huh! i wont forget his generosity.

So the gun trigger is working, turned out to be a dodgy connection up at the backbox. The cable was in, but not making full contact so i reseated that and its happy.

I noticed that when i lightly banged on the machine when in test mode, 2 of the targets, 1 especially (the one you have to hit on the skill shot) vibrated like hell sending the switch a little mental. As soon as i taped one of the switches up the random autofire drastically stopped. I have used the rubber Dialog sent me, and its nearly completely stopped. Had 5 or 6 games last night and not once did it shoot balls at me. HURRAH!
I never thought a switch vibrating would force balls into theplayfield!

so now another problem has arrisen. This machine loves to feed me problems. its trying to teach me how to fix pinballs i beleive... one issue at a time.

The ball feed/popper to the gun trigger is dodgy. Its weak and cant quite pop the ball hard enough. it has a go over and over and sometimes half gets there. If you bang or nudge the machine on the right timing u can assist it, but cant do that everytime. Im told ya look like an autistic drummer trying to hit in time of the popper. If i raise the playfield with the machine off, and manually pull the coil and play with the spring etc it wil usualy work for 4 or 5 balls then crap out again.
I looked on marvin3m's site, but its not specific or i just cant quite follow yet lol
im not sure if the coil is just buggered or if theres something else i should test?

thanks anyways guys. wouldnt of found this new love for pinnys if it wasnt for u guys :D

The Pinny Parlour
1st August 2006, 12:34 PM
right so firstly i have to give a HUUUUUUUUUGE thanks to DialogPimp.
He has sat on msn with me 2 nights in a row, all up for around 2-3 hours, troubleshooting my machine. I cant start to say how thankfull i am to him for sitting and wasting his personal time to help a stranger fix a pinny. Then yesterday i received mail from him, with some bits of rubber from clark rubber to put behind my targets. what a fella huh! i wont forget his generosity.

So the gun trigger is working, turned out to be a dodgy connection up at the backbox. The cable was in, but not making full contact so i reseated that and its happy.

I noticed that when i lightly banged on the machine when in test mode, 2 of the targets, 1 especially (the one you have to hit on the skill shot) vibrated like hell sending the switch a little mental. As soon as i taped one of the switches up the random autofire drastically stopped. I have used the rubber Dialog sent me, and its nearly completely stopped. Had 5 or 6 games last night and not once did it shoot balls at me. HURRAH!
I never thought a switch vibrating would force balls into theplayfield!

so now another problem has arrisen. This machine loves to feed me problems. its trying to teach me how to fix pinballs i beleive... one issue at a time.

The ball feed/popper to the gun trigger is dodgy. Its weak and cant quite pop the ball hard enough. it has a go over and over and sometimes half gets there. If you bang or nudge the machine on the right timing u can assist it, but cant do that everytime. Im told ya look like an autistic drummer trying to hit in time of the popper. If i raise the playfield with the machine off, and manually pull the coil and play with the spring etc it wil usualy work for 4 or 5 balls then crap out again.
I looked on marvin3m's site, but its not specific or i just cant quite follow yet lol
im not sure if the coil is just buggered or if theres something else i should test?

thanks anyways guys. wouldnt of found this new love for pinnys if it wasnt for u guys :D
There are some great people around here. Ain't it grand? Well done :D

DKong
1st August 2006, 02:59 PM
so now another problem has arrisen. This machine loves to feed me problems. its trying to teach me how to fix pinballs i beleive... one issue at a time.

The ball feed/popper to the gun trigger is dodgy. Its weak and cant quite pop the ball hard enough. it has a go over and over and sometimes half gets there. If you bang or nudge the machine on the right timing u can assist it, but cant do that everytime. Im told ya look like an autistic drummer trying to hit in time of the popper. If i raise the playfield with the machine off, and manually pull the coil and play with the spring etc it wil usualy work for 4 or 5 balls then crap out again.
I looked on marvin3m's site, but its not specific or i just cant quite follow yet lol
im not sure if the coil is just buggered or if theres something else i should test?

thanks anyways guys. wouldnt of found this new love for pinnys if it wasnt for u guys :D

Coil might be ok. Check the coil stop and sleeve. Sometimes you have to replace these parts if worn.

hamish_nz
1st August 2006, 03:04 PM
I agree with Dkong.
They most likely need to be replaced

bwodie
1st August 2006, 04:30 PM
had a little google around etc
how do i check the stop and sleeve, and what am i actually looking for?
thanks guys :)